Raising poly count in favor of a better optimization system
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Symon
We need a better system for optimization. Most people that modify the client in the first place is for the poly count. We need to raise the poly count as it doesn't negatively impact performance in a significant way. A big part of optimization is the mesh count and material count. We sound set the poly limit to 65,000 (the limit before unity splits meshes) and put a limit of 8 materials and 2 meshes (enough for cloth to work with 1 mesh and the other to be combined meshes). A lot of people have talked about this, but I really believe that this needs to be addressed because of the recent beta update which has a screen displaying the bannability of modified sdks. We should change to this system and push for banning modified sdks instead of pushing for banning the modified sdks before the change to prevent a LARGE amount of the community from being banned or it becoming a dm topic.
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Aev
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Avatar performance info has been expanded upon with VRChat 2018.4.4!
Pokerface Cactus
I agree with a higher poly limit but i very much dissagree with a 2 mesh maximum, one of my avatars had to be split into 8 different meshes because i couldn't make it work the way it had to due to unity bugs so i had to work around it, limiting the mesh limit would break my my most prized and favorite avatar ever that i spent a week on building.
Hagbard Celine
For what? If you need more detail use tessalation and normal maps. Even the worst model I found on my disk looks better with that.
Learn to bake normal maps from high poly models and add them to a low poly version.
btw: the model is around 17k polys.
May The Car Nerd
With people being banned for modified SDK's we are losing lots of players, eventually this may lead to streamers being banned and VRChat losing a large amount of influence.
Hope
I'd love a poly limit increase, since most of my avatars are usually around 50-65k. If people know how to decimate, people should theoretically know how to/be able to easily learn how to atlas. It's even available in the CATS program now. I'd say 3 meshes is fine, and 15-16 materials. I've made worlds with the same amount if not more and they run perfectly for VR and Desktop users. I don't think it's a proper comparison but still.
What's usually causing the lag is cloth, dynamic bones, some shaders, and particles. I feel like with better avatar optimization guides and possibly some sliders/graphic settings available ingame, a tri count increase is totally possible without limiting other options. If an avatar lags someone, they'd easily be able to fix it by adjusting settings.
`Squishy
I've always agreed on this, regarding both the poly limit and investigating some form of limits for the actual main optimisation offenders. Though just recently since the update, it feels more urgent due to the panic and confusion that the new loading screen information has caused.
I'm on several VRC related discords, and without any exaggeration at all, there's been mass panic about being banned should players log into the game without removing their 20k+ poly avatars first. I know one friend who legitimately deleted two thirds of his uploads in response to the rumours and misinformation that's been going around.
I've done my best to assure everyone that the loading screen rules are nothing more than the old terms of service we've always had, simply displayed in an additional location now. But when prominent messages about being banned for something that +80% of the regular community uses, start popping up, it's plenty understandable why people reacted the way they have.
If the poly limit was adjusted to a more sensible performance based allowance, there'd be no reason remaining for respectable users to even consider modifying the SDK anymore, and the community would actually change stance against those who do so. Further more, there would be far less people misusing it to breach the 65k mesh splitting point, and unwittingly causing very real performance drops.
Tupper - VRChat Head of Community
Changing the SDK so that it properly warns you for things that actually affect performance is on our near-term roadmap. Additionally, we have some more changes that will help manage your experience regarding performance in VRChat coming as well-- but as usual, patience is key. These things, they take time!
An increase in the polygon limit is an extremely long-standing request (it was around even before I started playing), but there's technical reasons to keep it in check. Regardless, we plan on revisiting the issue soon. I can make zero promises regarding any changes on the polygon/triangle limit, but I can tell you it will be part of the process when we update the SDK.
Again, and I'm repeating myself: this is not a guarantee. This board is for Feature Requests, not demands-- posting a request does not imply it will definitely be implemented eventually. However, we do hear you, and we are looking at these systems soon.
Edit: I'll also add that our moderation policies have not changed.
VRArt1
I'm kind of pissed at this point that despite how many times people ask for it and have given good reasons for increasing the tri limit that we aren't at least being given a reason why they seem to be specifically refusing to increase it.
Demirramon
I agree we need some sort of limit, but TWO meshes? I think that's too strict. My avatar has two-three meshes for the body, but then if I want to add toggleable objects like guns or sunglasses, those are one more mesh each. The 8 materials limit seems fine to me and leaves a lot of room, but only 2 meshes doesn't seem a good idea to me, at all. The limit should be around 8 as well, in my opinion.
VRArt1
Demirramon: the less meshes you have the better since each mesh it another drawcall. But I do agree a few more would be good for props.
Meeka Elle
Demirramon: Shape keys
Demirramon
Meeka Elle: but would shape keys be more efficient than a new object that only loads its polygons when triggered? It's an actual question, I have no idea.
Nifty255
Look, I’m sorry to do his to you, @Symon, but they’re not going to listen. There are likely more than a hundred topics on the exact same issue, but they’re not going to make any changes whatsoever because the idiots don’t know how graphics systems work. We’re never getting a higher limit, and even if they actually start banning, no one will obey the limit, and trolls (as a result of the devs) will continue killing the game until it fails and the company goes under.
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