World ranking system
tracked
SLǃM
It would be great to have a thumbs up, thumbs down system for worlds. A five star ranking system. Lately a lot of unfinished worlds have leaked into the game and more often than not with my friends I find myself checking out like 4 different worlds before we find something we like. It's a huge waste of time. It would be great to have the ability to rank worlds, having a top rated tab. So that way we can filter out maps that are low quality. A plus would be being able to write a review for a world as well.
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LoppyDaCutie
not a possibility because bots are a thing with vrchat osc, and they would spam the like button on most worlds anyways showing that the system you explained can be abused. people use the vote to kick function only to have a ton of bots join and vote to kick making it even more annoying. yes thats still a issue apparently.
This as I've explained will be a huge problem if there is a world ranking system.
It can be heavily abused all they would need to do is make a ton of usable emails set each email to a new vrchat account and then down or up rank the world itself. its explained that easy. I've met players who use alt accounts as well so its still a possibility this system will and can be abused.
Deantwo
LoppyDaCutie: I guess it could be limited to a trust rank, maybe
Known User
rank. That way completely new accounts can't be used to abuse it. But yes, it wouldn't fix the issue you describe in its entirety.Maybe one question is; would it matter if it was abused a bit? At most it would affect a special "sorted by community votes" list, and maybe the ego of some creators.
LoppyDaCutie
Deantwowe also got to take in the account of players discovering new worlds
Lightning Dasher
Deantwo I second this. Maybe even just limited to Trusted Users. Sounds reasonable that a person that is already "established" in the game has the insight needed to rate a world.
Disregarding the bot issues, a new user or even user probably wouldn't have much basis to structure a rating on, as they might not have seen many different worlds yet, or necessarily formed a good opinion yet on what defines a good or bad world.
So either way it should be limited to some rank.
Chdata
I might add:
Either "Like" or "Dislike" makes more sense and usable data than a nebulous subjective scale of 1-10 or 1-5 stars.
Being able to review worlds would be THE MOST useful to everyone involved. Think like Steam game reviews and/or literal reviews of google maps for real world locations.
Tom Leylan
I vote against any kind of shared world ranking system. There are enough games, movies, books, websites, products, etc., etc. ad infinitum that people can go rank according to their whim. Someone wastes some time, oh my. Everything doesn't require judgment from strangers.
Chdata
I want judgement from strangers because feedback will help me build better more interesting worlds.
Tom Leylan
Chdata Ask yourself "what action do i take if I get a thumbs down"? Oh but if 20 people give me a thumbs down then I can, what? One needs to know what the issue is. Maybe the audio is too loud (or soft), maybe it is too dark. Maybe it doesn't have enough mirrors and pens and needs 4 more pool tables. A 5-star rating doesn't tell anyone anything. Again do you go to a movie because it garnered 5 stars? Was it rate 5 stars by 10 year-olds and their parents? Everything has a context and these sorts of "like" ratings don't support that.
Chdata
Tom Leylan nah bro... that's why you have a review/comment thing like Steam does... so people can actually say why
Tom Leylan
Chdata got it. So you read the following with re: to your world and do what?
"If you wanted to be bombarded by furries and grown men either saying slurs or hitting on you this game is for you if you are like me those things do not interest you then I think you'll share my opinion that this game is bad."
Chdata
Tom Leylan
between your original payday example and this
you are trying way too hard to cherrypick
even one person taking the time to explain what they didn't like makes criticism worthwhile to a dev
Tom Leylan
Chdata I'm not cherry picking you are making up scenarios that never take place in the real world. If you need to be a reviewer and award stars to people you can do that on other sites already. If I criticize this post you don't see it as valuable criticism and the same would happen if people awarded your world 1 star. You would disagree and arguments would ensue. VRC has better things to spend their time on.
Chdata
Tom Leylan
Nah dude, I'm arguing from experience. I developed for a server in another game and collected feedback from my playerbase.
Feedback is useful. Period. I would want it for developing VRChat worlds too.
Hardly anyone is going to review VRChat worlds in an off-VRChat website. That's a real nonsense made-up scenario.
Your point earlier was that even if players could leave comments about your world, a lot of them would be useless comments?
That's true, but not everyone will do that. Some people will leave real feedback, and that is what any developer worth their salt wants. Even people just expressing what they dislike is useful to a smart developer.
Also, not all criticism is valuable, as you pointed out, a lot of people leave nonsense on Steam reviews. And in the case of this discussion, your argument is just incorrect. Any good developer knows the customer isn't always right ;)
Many of VRChat's biggest updates are around giving better tools to developers to make the things they make, and a Steam-like review system is one of those things.
Tom Leylan
Chdata I'm coming from 40 years of professional software development. You example of a "game" with a user-base is not applicable to VRC and random people jumping into random worlds.
You have a lot of time on your hands if you created 20 worlds and then make modifications based upon some strangers telling you what they don't like about it. When you make the changes have 10 others told you that they don't like those changes? Is "Mark2002" happy now that you changed the music? Did he give you one more star?
Of all the things that could be added to VRC some sort of world review/rating system is among the worst. A new place for even more arguments, like there aren't enough of those right now.
Chdata
Well, I hate to break it to you, Tom, but people argue on the internet.
And many people are literally making "game" worlds in VRChat. They have since the beginning. Doing the thing you seem to be dismissing.
Ghostt
I can't believe I haven't even noticed that worlds don't have a user ranking system. I agree that worlds need some kind of ranking system.
However, keep in mind the psychology of likes v. dislikes and how that would affect the world creator when it feels unfair for them.
Also, keep in mind that groups of people could mass downvote certain creators' worlds, so there would need to be protection against that.
Scout
tracked
A
Azurequan
支持
Fax
Merged in a post:
World Reviews!!
Dyslex1k
World reviews
In Vrchat right now we have two major problems with worlds:
- Creators get little to no feedback.
- Users don't know if worlds are worth downloading.
This is because at a glance worlds have little to no information on either the quality or the experience of the world. This has made quite a lot of "Clickbait" worlds where an image is used to bait users into joining, just to realize it's the 20th white box in a row.
This also means users cannot warn other users of bad experiences such as: flashing lights, high bloom, loud sounds and even potentially offensive content.
On the creator side reviews would be very useful to get feedback as current methods are awkward on the user side to do. This would help massively with any project people work on, enabling creators to learn and improve their skills.
Potential Implementation
This could be as simple as it being on the website, this could be:
-A Star system (1-5)
-Likes and dislikes (eg. Roblox)
-Text reviews from users
For in game a star system or likes and dislikes would work better.
Issues
There are a few problems I would see immediately, including:
- Users may spam reviews
- Reviews would have to be filtered
- A world creator might be disliked into oblivion
Conclusion
This system would be very useful for both Vrchat users and Vrchat Creators. Vrchat creators would benefit massively from text reviews whereas Vrchat users would benefit more from ratings such as: likes and dislikes or Stars.
I think this would be a great tool for everyone that we will use a lot!
Fax
Merged in a post:
World voting system
Salbug
While I know there is an existing canny of it in the general feedback canny section, now that we have the new menu and everything, it'd be pretty great if we could have a voting system (upvotes, downvotes) for worlds that way we could have an idea at a glance just what to expect from a world. Of course there are downsides to voting and the abuse that can be done, but otherwise I think the benefits outway the negatives.
ni1chigo2115
It might be nice if the creator of the world could pick out reviews that he/she likes.
(Unselected reviews would have to be picked through the debris by the user.)
One way to do this is to have "good" reviews introduce problems, warnings, etc. that the world producer may not be aware of.
ワールドの製作者が好きなレビューをピックアップできるとうれしいかもしれませんね。
（選ばれなかったレビューはユーザーががれきの中から探す必要があります。）
ワールド製作者が気づかないような問題点、警告などを”優良な”レビューを通して紹介してもらうのも一つの手段です。
これは日本語でのみでの提案ですが、星の数を任意でランク付けするのではなく、SteamのようにGOODかBADを選ぶ形式にするのがいいと思います
Steamのレビューシステムは見習うべき場所が多く、レビューの結果によって星の数が変わるように総評が変化し、レビューに対してさらにリアクションを行うことができます。
R
Ranelson
i think this both a partially good idea and a bad idea.
i do think there is some potential in the leaving dislike and likes, but the comment review is a AWFUL idea.
As you referred in the canny, roblox does this. But roblox has a HUGE issue with being spammed in the comments, and i think thats exactly what will happen with this, even with it filtered. Not to mention how people will just make a bunch of alt accounts and spam stuff. Also what about updates? a creator might have a major bug, or issue in a world, fix it, but now they have a bunch of bad reviews saying they cant go into the room or somthing, when, now they can! but no one will check it out since everyone says its bugged. Also, 8/10 times, someone only leaves feedback, if they have a complaint.
Id also like to bring up the fact that there is a like button prefab currently, for creators who want to put a like button.
Dyslex1k
Ranelson: I realised after posting this moderation would be an issue, A solution to this problem could be only if you are in world (tho like prefab already does this) the benefit is that worlds likes could be viewed from the website or ingame.
Spam in the reviews is a good point. On further thought feedback messages could be better but even then the spam and hateful message issue still exists. This would probably would require much better moderation on Vrchat's behalf!
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